This is a Rant…
Cheap men really bother me. I mean they really really bother me. So let me be even more clear:
(this calls for bullets)
- If you ask me out, there is no way that I am paying for the date or going dutch. Doing such will set precedent for the rest of the relationship, and I am not paying for the rest of our dates for as long as I know you. Period.
- If I ask you out, I will pay for me but not you. And you as a man should still offer to pay.
- My Grandfather told me that if a man wants my time he has to pay for it. It shows that he is willing to put forth an effort. They are old school and tradtional and I like that about them.
- No chain restaraunts when you say you want to take me to dinner.
Ok, so now you are looking at me like I am a major B-I but that’s just how I feel. Take it or love it or leave it. I went on a date with this guy. He asked me out. It was like our third date. We werent going out to eat but I was hungry. So I say, lets stop at baja fresh. He says cool. Dead ass, he doesn’t pay for my burrito. I never saw him again.
Shallow? Maybe. Progressive? Probably not. Do I feel guilty? Hell to the no bobby.
FeFe Fatale
Jolie Fatale
FeFe Fatale
39 Comments
July 30, 2008 at 11:24 am
I feel the same way! This one guy asked me if I wanted to grab something for lunch. So he orders and so do I . So when I see him pulling out his money he’s only calculating his food. I had to pay for my own lunch . I’ve ignored him ever since.
July 30, 2008 at 1:01 pm
ok.. well views of fefe arent always my views but they are similar.. here goes
I AGREE with this point. If you ask me out or vice versa it should be expected that the person who asked pay for the date. It is just common courtesy
I DISAGREE. If I ask a man out I dont think it should ever be a situation where the other person doesnt pay for the other unless it has been soley expresse that the two are going DUTCH.
*”My Grandfather told me that if a man wants my time he has to pay for it. It shows that he is willing to put forth an effort. They are old school and tradtional and I like that about them.”*
DISAGREE .. sorry gramps.. I think that men should court women they are interested in but I do not agree that they should PAY for my time in a sense. I mean usually dates cost but they dont always have to be elaborate and I think that just the wording throws me off. I get what your getting at but not totally.
*”No chain restaraunts when you say you want to take me to dinner.*”
AGREED. Living in the DMV area there are enough reasonably priced restaurants where a Chilli’s, Applebees or Jaspers never has to be visited
July 30, 2008 at 1:02 pm
First off, I think paying for a date every once in a while shows confidence, security and shows that u care about the relationship and where its going just as much as he does.
Second, most guys look at it in a who do you think you are to think that your time is that damn valuable to me when I hardly know you prospective.Not thinking that you should ever pay for a date,even if YOU did the inviting shows total selfishness and who wants to start off a relationship with a girl that is too selfish to pay for a meal on occasion. I believe in old school traditions but I also realize that things have changed immensely and that you have to bend a little.Otherwise selfish Sally will never be wifed.
July 30, 2008 at 1:03 pm
Men that live above their means trying to impress women bother me. I guess I’m weird for being attracted to humilty, growth and goals.
Paying for time? Isn’t that what prostitutes call it?
*scurries away
July 30, 2008 at 1:21 pm
Prince Akeem said it to Semmi best (Coming to America if you happen to live under a rock): “But it is also tradition that times must and always do change, my friend.”
I really really really didn’t want to rant….BUT…you’re grandfather’s logic made a bit more sense for the time period that he grew up in. Far fewer women had careers outside of the house, so if a woman isn’t really making any money, how could she really pay for dates?
And after marriage, the expectations were that the wife would take care of the household and the husband would make the money. That’s why courting needed to happen that way.
But this is how we get ourselves in a little pickle. Because here in this year, I believe it’s 2008 now, men AND women expect equal partnerships, equal decision-making, etc. Now, if this is not the type of relationship you seek, then sure you’re grandfather’s theory might be best.
* End of a rant that I am certain will not change your mind one eency bit.
** I retain the right to rant another day.
July 30, 2008 at 1:33 pm
women have fallen into the notion that we always have to prove our independence. and i think thats wack. I dont need to pay for myself just to show the man that i have the capability to do so. and thats just how i was raised. i dont think its selfish at all.
thats really all i am going to say about that. i hate when blogs turn into some deep ass Educated Black Person conversation. its meant to be lighthearted. folks lighten up. relax. go for a drink, smoke a blunt and then get some good D. lol. jk. but seriously, every dating rant i have somehow goes back to the “Plight of the Black Woman in todays Sexist Society” or “How Black Women Dating and the Recession or Inversely Related”
Its not that deep folks.
*note: i will contradict myself tomorrow as it will be a new day.
July 30, 2008 at 1:39 pm
I meant to close this screen, but since I didn’t…it’s really hard to state such a narrowminded view and they say lighten up. No?
I mean, if this lighthearted tone was stated somewhere – oh probably in the beginning, or during the bullets or maybe even the short story – I clearly wouldn’t have wasted my time and commented.
But NOW that you’ve cleared that up, I’ll scurry along.
*scurries
July 30, 2008 at 1:44 pm
“My Grandfather told me that if a man wants my time he has to pay for it. It shows that he is willing to put forth an effort. They are old school and tradtional and I like that about them. ”
Sometimes unsaid’s when written really don’t look well when read. But I think on some level this is true. A man in my opinion on some level should be able to demonstrate his ability to court and ***potentially*** provide. I hate making excuses for men. But him paying in the beginning is the norm and expected.
July 30, 2008 at 1:46 pm
no i dont like putting caveats in the beginning, it takes away from the effect. but also, do you really read blogs and take them seriously. they are editorials. mere personal opinion. its not world news tonight with Peter Jennings.
i think the things i say are so ridiculous that they could never be taken seriously. it does, however, make for interesting convo.
oh and to be serious, i totally agree with your comment when you talked about the coming to america thing. and place granpa’s advice in context to the time that which he was out on the dating scene. agreed.
July 30, 2008 at 1:47 pm
You’re kidding, right? This is a joke, right?
Well … cheap women who’d be onery (to understate it) if I called them a golddigger really bother me. Really really bother me.
Let my response be clear (no bullets needed): Doing something ONCE (like going dutch) doesn’t mean it will be done every time – not every man is that way. I know you’d be picking up your own tab with me with that high-maintenance attitude. Furthermore, where was the advice of “perhaps you should consider whether it’s worth letting him pay if you think he’ll be ‘expecting something’ at the end of the night.”
You don’t pay for dates either? Don’t get me wrong, I’d never ask a woman to pick up the entire tab, but as a man it does feel nice to be appreciated every now and again, and some will even tell you it’s polite to at least offer to pay your share, even if the man is dead set against it.
An earlier comment also had it right – you’re no therapist, nor are you a lawyer, so paying for your time (especially by the hour) sure does sound like prostitution to me. Your grandfather sounds more like Archbishop Don Magic Juan than Don Juan. It’s also hypocritical to expect someone to pay for you if they ask you out, but not extend the same courtesy. Any man – a dog or a Don – can see that much.
No chain restaurants? Get over it. A chinese buffet doesn’t have to be a chain restaurant, so would you mind that for a date? Seems like your focus is on the wrong things … but in the interim, I hope you’re enjoying the single life. I also hope the guy who didn’t pick up your burrito is laughing at this post with his new woman.
V. Clev nailed it on the head – “it’s 2008 now, men AND women expect equal partnerships, equal decision-making …” In the meantime, your formula does nothing but equal laughter.
July 30, 2008 at 1:49 pm
“Cheap men really bother me.”
Amen and PTL (Praise The Lord)…I think some men need to get their prorities straight. Another poster said that men shouldn’t be trying to floss JUST to impress. I agree.
If you;re gonna coupon date, get your mind right about being self-sufficient enough to afford your need to “date around and in array”.
finally somebody who understands me LOL.
July 30, 2008 at 1:57 pm
*scurries back
Ok, so is this your personal opinion or not? Because if it is your personal opinion, then whether it is lighthearted is completely irrelevant. If you have another personal opinion tomorrow, I will agree or disagree with that one
So, do you want interesting convo or not? Because if you do want interesting convo then there is no need to tell us that “it’s not that deep” once the conversation begins.
July 30, 2008 at 2:02 pm
@comeback
Cheap MEN BOTHER ME TOO!
July 30, 2008 at 2:02 pm
@ V.CLEV
this is my personal opinion for today. Feel free to agree or disagree tomorrow as I will pretty much do the same.
yes, keep up the interesting convo.
July 30, 2008 at 2:03 pm
@ Vintage
call it how you see it my brotha. If you think it’s gold diggin or not, it’s cool with me.
July 30, 2008 at 2:04 pm
I found this blog post to be very disturbing, shallow, gold-diggerish. I am outright embarrassed for other “Black Femme Fatales” and any other women who agree with your comment and your grandfather’s opinion on the matter. You’re thinking like a girl and not a WOMAN. Your perspective is setting you up to be perceived as a stereotypical gold-digger who is only out for a man’s money. Your antiquated thinking does not translate well in today’s dating environment. If a woman doesn’t at least offer to pay (not that I will take her up on it) after the third date, I am going to think that she is selfish and only after one thing – the money in my pockets…
I’m not surprised that you never went out with the guy who didn’t pay for your burrito again. But it was probably his decision – not yours – as a result of your immature perspective on dating. Good luck finding a guy in the 21st Century who’s willing to pay for everything. Since you want to be treated like the men treated women back in your grandfather’s day, maybe you should start dating one of your grandpa’s homeboys.
July 30, 2008 at 2:13 pm
Why do men take a few paragraphs and then proceed to twist them like a twist lock. Who said that the woman WOULD NEVER EVER PAY EVER. On the first date if he’s looking at me cross eyed after asking me out, then he shouldn’t be dating ANYONE. If he thinks he’s constantly gonna get ganked for his paper, he needs to take a harder look at who he is dating.
The problem is that women in this dating envoirnment have enabled me HORRIBLY. Crippled them. To constantly think “who got next”.
I like to surprise men that on the 3rd or 4th date I will pay. But when you expect somebody to get you for your paper, you are meeting the wrong women and your mind isn’t right about the process.
July 30, 2008 at 2:14 pm
meant ***have enabled them horribly.***
July 30, 2008 at 2:18 pm
HO SIT DOWN AND GO EAT AT THE PUNCH OUT!!!WITH YOUR BROKE ASS!!!! YOUR ASS IS UGLY ANYWAY. I KNOW WHO YOU ARE!!!!!
WOMEN LIKE YOU WHO MAKE BLACK MEN DATE WHITE WOMEN!!!
July 30, 2008 at 2:34 pm
who in the he&& left the gate open ….
July 30, 2008 at 2:35 pm
@thisbitch: This is a peaceful blog and I highly doubt you know us. There are two of us! We have two different opinons and two different outlooks and sometimes we think alike. So please.. date white women if you like..it wont hurt our feelings sweetie.
July 30, 2008 at 2:42 pm
hmmm. although i disagree with a couple of the caveats (especially the no chain thing, which i’m probably gonna write about next week), i do agree with the overall premise. theres nothing wrong with courting and with a woman expecting a guy to court.
now, don’t get me wrong, i definitely do appreciate and will eventually expect some form of reciprocation, whether its a home cooked meal, steelers tickets, or head, but the overall vaginal stock will continue to plummet as long as chicks continue to haphazardly flood the marketplace with it.
admittedly, as a bachelor, i’ve reaped the benefits of the low priced stock, but, realistically and practically speaking, the old-school way works better.
July 30, 2008 at 2:47 pm
@thechamp: CHAINS are something I abhore! I think I’ve commented it about on your site.. but I think it would be a good post. I love your site!
July 30, 2008 at 3:06 pm
look . First of all, who response to there own FUCKING blog?! Secondly I do know who FEFE is…. Dont play yourself…. You know that the PUNCH OUT is ?!
July 30, 2008 at 3:21 pm
@ This Bitch is Stupid
1. negro you don’t a thing about me. trust you SO dont know me. and there is no way you could.
2. Sorry that you are a man scorned. Cheap maybe? take offense much? Sensitive often?
3. It’s my blog, why wouldnt i respond? It’s mine.
4. You can calm down and stop trying to curse someone out on here. There is no need for the hostility.
@CHAMP… thanks for looking at the post with a clear perspective. others (ref: above commenter) can learn from you
July 30, 2008 at 3:55 pm
Can you please name five non- chain restaurants in the DMV area that YOU know of and not the men who took you to those places. Please do not name Lauriol Plaza, Alero, B.Smith, Sequoia, Clydes, Chessecake Factory, these are all chain restaturants that you probably like.
July 30, 2008 at 3:57 pm
Hm,
Where to start..where to start…in trying my best not to add to this stagnant blatantly non-progressive issue (argh, just did) I would like to say that this is a bit wild of you. Why wild? (this calls for asterisks)
* If you work, and are a self supportive independent woman then please, be so. I’m sure when people ask if you have a job or car or your own place you are quick to jump and say “hell yea mofo!” So why not do the same here? Stingy with the pockets is not hot, unless you are broke…not pointing any fingers…i’m not.
*Chivalry isn’t dead yet but stuff like this shoots bullets at it’s head. I appreciate the old school feel to it but when you say if you ask me out you STILL expect me to pay for it is wild, jungle wild. Like, from what I read above, at NO point do I see you paying for our meal, ever! Greedy much?
*I’m sure when you wrote this you felt this way but if you met someone you really liked and went out with them you’d probably spring for the bill once, at least one! This is true.
*Please cut back on Sex & the City (re-runs included)…I think that show has ruined plenty of the good women…this isn’t TV. I just WISH people would come down a little bit, just a little bit. Cool off.
July 30, 2008 at 4:11 pm
@The Stupid Bitch
on U Street: creme, marvins, duke’s city, ulah bistro, marvins, jojo’s
Georgetown: Miss Siagon, Bangkok Bistro
then we have Tenleytown.. oh and Bethesda: Blackies! (Good spot.. you should take your next date there)
July 30, 2008 at 4:13 pm
@ this bitch
(i like that you named yourself that… “this bitch”) lmao.
how about all of U st. – they have great restaurants – creme, utah bistro, jojo’s,marvin’s, mahogany, duke’s city, tabaq
wait i think you just want me to help you with your next date plan
@ A. Musin
you are absolutely right. i wrote this aftera bad date
July 30, 2008 at 4:14 pm
see Jolie got my back
then there is old town alexandria, annapolis has private restaurants…. and none of these that we named are extremely expensive.
July 30, 2008 at 5:13 pm
WOW.. You girls got on online and googled up Ust Restaurants and began typing them . Creme is ok. You should try the brunch there it is better then the food. Same as for Duke City. Mahogany is only good for music and drinks, Marvins is only good for the Duck and white wine. Not a large food selection but it has a good crowd. It is also owned by the same people who own Local 16 ( which i would have named that before i named Marvins) and 18th st lounge.
Tabaq food sucks…. We are talking about real restaurants not shit that is on Ust. I have never gone to Utah Bistro but i heard it was cool.
Damn, you girls are cheap and easy to impress if it only take a dude to take u to UST…….
Please comment back if you like for me to give you more rec.
July 30, 2008 at 5:21 pm
I would like to apologize if i offended you two. Please dont take the B-word or me making rude comments as being serious. However, my recommendation on restaurats are True. Please step your game up
July 30, 2008 at 7:53 pm
This is the second time that I’ve been on a site where a poster pops on and thinks that its endearing to insult the blog owner/s.
@ this bitch…dear this is NOT how you win and influence friends. If you disagree with the writers there is a better delivery for your argument.
July 30, 2008 at 8:52 pm
This is a simple observation….why pay for a meal if its not a real investment, its like going to the club without letting the female choose, you buy her a drink for no apparent reason while she may or may not be looking at someone else and of course she may or may not give you her number, you understand the trend? You never Win with this Quid Pro Quo, Don’t Want what you Don’t Want….if you keep looking for someone to buy you stuff all the time you will get someone who wants to just hit all the time, you recruit WHO YOU ARE….
July 31, 2008 at 1:22 pm
@ this bitch:
This is the last time I am going to give any energy to responding to you. Cleary you dont read.
geez.. and like seriously the argument is about chains
so of course the expensive high end restaurants arent on there
the point is
you can go to a restaurant not spend a lotta money
and it doesnt have to be a chain.
End ARGUMENT
but other great spots NOT ON YOUR STREET ARE:
Al Crostino
Minibar at Cafe Atlantico
Oya
Sushi-Ko
Tabard Inn
and if you wanna venture to Falls Church got to 2941..
These are all places I have been on for dates.. no internet required
July 31, 2008 at 2:29 pm
I have to say I was damned near offended after reading this … then i just got depressed and hope things work out for you.
Like it was mentioned … its crazy to hold on to these really old chivalrous concepts that applied to a time centuries ago. Also, the fact that you have such a hatred for chains is a little much … there are actually good chain restaurants.
This mentality of “he must do for me” often is used by selfish women to justify their selfishness. I have met some women who are just as demanding, but give just as much. I know one girl who refuses to pay for anything when going out, but buys me clothes, goes crazy with bday gifts, and let me know that she actually did want to do for me.
Good luck with dating around the DC area … I know me and my friend aint f*cking with your list of “demands”. Sad to say .. but it would get you that gold digger label.
August 1, 2008 at 5:04 am
[...] read a post over at Black Femme Fatale and I might still be offended. Has to do with the elaborate demands placed upon a man when it [...]
August 3, 2008 at 6:20 pm
So black women can wonder why some black men are in the process of no longer giving them the time of day. I would like to preface this by first saying that I just about exclusively date black women, I’m open to other ethnicities, but mama was a strong black woman, and its just my personal preference, but this is a mess. I am ALL for treating your lady exceptionally well, and true, if I’m inviting you out on a date, I’m expecting beforehand to pay, but that’s a two way street. If I’m fine sitting around and doing nothing, and you call me up on some “lets go do this or that”, I was perfectly fine doing whatever it was that I was doing, although I might offer, it shouldn’t be a SURPRISE that you are the one taking care of the bill this time around.
Don’t get it twisted, men may not need OVERT MANIFESTATIONS of romanticism in order to keep us content, however we do like to be romanced and made to feel special just as much as you do.
You are in the DC area as well…, most of the year I’m in DC going to law school, and with the HIV infection rate being as high as it is out there, its already TOUGH AS HELL trying to date. This bit of pettiness is just limiting that talent pool even more!
PS- i’m not sure what your grandfather was doing, but last I checked, paying for time with a young lady is a crime! “Jail free is the way to be”
August 4, 2008 at 4:49 am
I am directing my comment strictly to the original post.
The issue in this rant is. deciphering what kind of man you want. A sub-issue may be what kind of man would want a. woman like you. Generally, if. a woman is bothered by. something, she will not be attracted to a man who does. that something. Here, you have stated “cheap men bother” you. Therefore, you will not be attracted to a cheap man. Simple logic right? Methinks so.
A flaw in the logic presented will appear when you think about the type of man you will or will not end up with. For instance, say that man at the bar who is physically, emotionally, and intellectually exactly what you desire. However, the man is not financially stable enough to take you to a restaurant that would prove his “un-cheapness” to you because he is, say, a graduate student. Making the reasonable assumption that once the man who has everything you want EXCEPT the cash to take you La Peridot in Penn Quarter (green or yellow line to national archives, enter on Indiana, OR complimentary valet make a left from 7th street) graduates he will make more than enough money to feed you the best food in DC (which is usually NOT the expensive fare most people assume is so delicious). However, that man knows that when he could not take you to that restaurant you did not think he was good. enough to date! He will assume you are a gold-digger and will probably write you off if you seem interested only when he starts getting paid. The man will probably not want to give you the time of day and will probably end up with the girl who didn’t mind eating chinese take-out and sharing the big iced-tea from Ho-chi.
Conversely, if you date the man who is willing to run up his credit cards to take you out to eat, its more likely that you two would settle down and find out the dude has more debt than…well, America, and now you two can’t get a home or even worse he can’t afford to buy you a ring! But you ate well, right?
What remains to be seen is whether you are able to handle the guy who may not have the money to give you the best of everything right now but does have the character, ambition, and drive to give you the world when he is better suited financially to take on such a (presumably) daunting task.
While men sometime waste time and money on a silly breeze who craves material things, we usually know a chick like that is not a keeper-no matter how beautiful she is.
I am a traditionalist and I would expect to pay in most date situations. I would not expect a girl I date to demand I always pay. She would quickly become a girl I used to date.